LineOut vs. Headphone Out

AlexP · 09-19-2005, 12:30

Hi,

I recently got the X5 device and now I want to know, if anything speaks against using the X5 in the car using the Headphone out to go in the Aux-In of the car hifi system.

Because I think that would be much more convenient, because then I don't need the cradle in the car.

Can somebody explain the difference of the two outputs.

Thanks

Alex

taz · 09-19-2005, 13:15

as i beleive the headphone out goes through the players amp whereas the line out bypasses this and is just the pure signal without any influences from the internal amp or the players EQ settings.

it is better to use line out for your purpose and then use the settings such as equaliser or bass and treble settings on your head unit to change the sound.

you can also use the headphone jack. nothing really wrong with it. the internal amp isnt designed to be used with speakers an line in on equipment which is why there is a line out on many players.

give it a try to see if you notice any sound difference. im sure you will hear a little difference.

the answer to your question is it really dont matter. its not going to damage your player or your car system.just make sure you turn off all sound enhancements as this will improve SQ. mach3 bass and such seem to distort bass which comes out of speakers. so does the EQ

Pete7874 · 09-19-2005, 14:04

As a matter of fact, there's been a lengthy discussion here on the forum that the Headphone out provides better sound than line out. There's nothing wrong with using the Headphone out for your purposes.

taz · 09-19-2005, 17:22

i personally dont really understand but ah well. i guess it depends what you have the players line out connected to.

niuphan · 09-19-2005, 17:46

There is a difference between the two.

The BIGGEST difference I have noticed is the volume level transmitted from the line out vs. the headphone jack. The volume level is at an "unacceptable level" when using the headphone jack. I have to set the volume at almost 40 to get a reasonable amout of "volume" to my stereo using the headphone jack.

If you use the line out, the volume is at its peak. Keep in mind you must turn off all of your equalizer settings (BBE, etc) to zero or off. Otherwise the line out will not work any different than the headphone jack.

The sub-pack is a MAJOR pain in the ass and very easily separates from the unit (even MORE so if you have a silicon case). This is a terrible design for someone who constantly uses the line out such as myself. There needs to be a line out jack on the unit!!!! C'mon Cowan!!!!

taz · 09-19-2005, 18:12

the reason why there is a big difference with the volume is because the headphone jack was only intended for headphones. the line out is just a headphones jack which is already set to volume 40.

what ive found is the sound enhancements work with the headphone out but when you use the line out and sound enhancements are on, the sound is not good.

maby this is the reason why some people complain of the line out not sounding good. it may be because they leave their sound enhancements on.

Lambart · 09-19-2005, 19:44

Well, what people are saying about line-out being amplified to 40/40 makes no sense--the entire concept of line-out is that it is UNamplified and un(post-)processed, allowing you to use your preferred external amplifier (i.e. home or car stereo). And I can confirm that when I use the line-out on my X5, the audio is much quieter than the headphone jack.

UNFORTUNATELY... I am just using line-out for the first time this evening, and it has no output on the right channel! Whether I use my base station or adaptor widget (sub-pack), I only have one channel. Has anyone else had this problem? No, it's not a misadjusted "pan" setting (and once again, logically, that internal amplifier setting should have no effect on line-out). I'm having to use the headphone jack right now for my home stereo, which is absurd (and since I'm using the same cable to the stereo, that eliminates the cable as a possible problem).

Does anyone think it might it be a firmware problem (I'm using 2.10b4-e), or am I going to have to return my unit? I can't live without it... I finally got rid of my Rio Karma, which at least worked!

Pete7874 · 09-19-2005, 20:51

Sounds like something is disconnected, either inside your subpack or inside the X5 itself. RMA time.

PropagandaX · 09-19-2005, 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lambart

Well, what people are saying about line-out being amplified to 40/40 makes no sense--the entire concept of line-out is that it is UNamplified and un(post-)processed, allowing you to use your preferred external amplifier (i.e. home or car stereo). And I can confirm that when I use the line-out on my X5, the audio is much quieter than the headphone jack.

UNFORTUNATELY... I am just using line-out for the first time this evening, and it has no output on the right channel! Whether I use my base station or adaptor widget (sub-pack), I only have one channel. Has anyone else had this problem? No, it's not a misadjusted "pan" setting (and once again, logically, that internal amplifier setting should have no effect on line-out). I'm having to use the headphone jack right now for my home stereo, which is absurd (and since I'm using the same cable to the stereo, that eliminates the cable as a possible problem).

Does anyone think it might it be a firmware problem (I'm using 2.10b4-e), or am I going to have to return my unit? I can't live without it... I finally got rid of my Rio Karma, which at least worked!

I have the same problem on my home reciever. I too am left using the headphone jack. I tried my other sub-pack and docking station with the same result. It has to be the player.

Lambart · 09-19-2005, 21:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by PropagandaX

I too am left using the headphone jack.

Also left, eh? Sounds like there must be a mis-soldered or broken trace inside the player... perhaps something wrong with the manufacturing process since we're both missing the same channel (admittedly it's a 50/50 chance but I'll bet we're not the only ones...)

NoComp · 09-20-2005, 10:40

Hy iAUDIO's!

My Subpack Line-Out is also definately faulty!!!! (and yes, I know every post on this forum about the Subpack's Line-Out. Only because this is my first post this doesn't mean I'm new to this forum)

Only the right channel has a "normal" output-level, the left channel has only about the half of the right level!

Why am I so sure that the subpack is the guilty part? Because the Line-out of my Black X5 Cradle is working absolutely fine! Same FULL Output-Level at both Channels!!!!

I connected the Line-out's (Cradle & Subpack) to my PC-Audiocard and made some pics of the Level-meters. I used the same song and the same Volume-Level and sent this to COWON-Support!

And guess, NO REPLY EVER ON MY REQUESTS FROM COWON!!!! Nor at the Cowon Tech-Support-Forum at their english Homepage!!!

One month ago I tried to get a replacement, but after two weeks my German Reseller (mp3-player.de) sent the same subpack back to me - of course with the same faulty Line-Out!

Just had a talk with the mp3-player.de-Support and they told me, that they can't get a hold on one single brand new subpack from COWON!!! They can only replace the whole UNIT!!!! (This would cost me about 15 Euros for insured shipping)

As it seems COWON won't ever sell subpacks to their European Resellers as it seems!!!! But as we all know these damn subpacks are sold from Cowon-America on ebay.com for 9$ a piece!!!

wtf is goin' on COWON?!?!?!

The longer I own my X5 30GB the more I love my X5 but the more I hate COWON for its lousy Support-Policy!! Kind of schizophrenic, but nevertheless better than the other way round I guess.

But nevertheless, I'm soooo glad that I'm not the only one with this problem!

taz · 09-20-2005, 10:54

therees so many more line out problems for the x5 than there was for the m3. well my m3's cradle and sub pack are both fine.

but then again more x5's were probably sold than the m3's. but i dont get it when they should have had the same production techniques and product line creating the subpacks. unless quality control has decreast.

NoComp · 09-20-2005, 11:01

Forgot some interesting detail:

As it seems the most Subpacks sold with the first manufactured X5's where original Subpacks designed for the M3!!! Of course I know they also look the same!

I once opened my faulty subpacks casing (please read my posting above if you're interested into the Line-Out fault) and found the following tags on the subpacks inner life:

M3 V1.1 (in big white letters)

I also opened my Black x5-Cradle with the working Line-Out and found following information:

Model: M1.3C-A 1.9
M3C_B 1.7

My conclusion: As it seems the subpacks electronic could have been renewed for the X5, so some other people don't recognize any faulty Line-Out anymore!
My X5 was one of the first 100 units on the european Market! Maybe thats the point!

SO TO EVERYBODY NOT EXPERIENCING ANY SUBPACK LINE-OUT PROBLEMS (the problem with the faulty left Line-Out-Channel):

Could you please open your subpacks and check if your subpack-Version is never than M3 V1.1 and post your findings here? By the way its really easy to open (just 2 small screws).

All people with this annoying Line-Out fault (including myself) would appreciate any information!!

Thanks to everybody for helpin'

NoComp · 09-20-2005, 11:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lambart

Does anyone think it might it be a firmware problem (I'm using 2.10b4-e), or am I going to have to return my unit? I can't live without it... I finally got rid of my Rio Karma, which at least worked!

I have the same Firmware 2.10b4-e and a serious Line-Out fault too! But the same fault was also there with all other firmwares but it vanishes as I connect to the Cradles Line-Out!

I'm pretty shure it's a faulty Subpack Line-Out! There seems to be a whole production-Line of Subpacks with similar Line-Out faults!

Try to get your hands on a Cradle or maybe at least another Subpack for testing the Line-Out! Hopefully you will see, that your X5's Line-out is OK!

Btw: Open your Subpack and check the Version (mine is M3 V1.1)

spago · 09-20-2005, 14:39

Regarding the line out channel problem, try re-seating the subpack and try not putting any upward or downwards pressure on it.

I'd like to see feedback from M3 owners with access to RMAA on the bass fall-off issue. My guess is that the issue has existed since over a year ago when the M3 was released.

I personally don't think the Line Out sounds that 'bad'. It's just that it lacks bass and there may be some additional distortion effects... but not an unlistenably offensive amount.

09-19-2005, 14:04	#3
Pete7874 X5 killa Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 738	As a matter of fact, there's been a lengthy discussion here on the forum that the Headphone out provides better sound than line out. There's nothing wrong with using the Headphone out for your purposes. __________________ X5 20GB + Shure E2C

09-19-2005, 20:51	#8
Pete7874 X5 killa Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 738	Sounds like something is disconnected, either inside your subpack or inside the X5 itself. RMA time. __________________ X5 20GB + Shure E2C

09-20-2005, 14:39	#15
spago Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 166	Regarding the line out channel problem, try re-seating the subpack and try not putting any upward or downwards pressure on it. I'd like to see feedback from M3 owners with access to RMAA on the bass fall-off issue. My guess is that the issue has existed since over a year ago when the M3 was released. I personally don't think the Line Out sounds that 'bad'. It's just that it lacks bass and there may be some additional distortion effects... but not an unlistenably offensive amount. __________________ They don't want music, they don't know how to use it, All they want is a boom, boom, boom, boom, boom boom boom dedicated to all the EX71 owners

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09-19-2005, 12:30	#1
AlexP Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 4	Hi, I recently got the X5 device and now I want to know, if anything speaks against using the X5 in the car using the Headphone out to go in the Aux-In of the car hifi system. Because I think that would be much more convenient, because then I don't need the cradle in the car. Can somebody explain the difference of the two outputs. Thanks Alex

09-19-2005, 13:15	#2
taz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 683	as i beleive the headphone out goes through the players amp whereas the line out bypasses this and is just the pure signal without any influences from the internal amp or the players EQ settings. it is better to use line out for your purpose and then use the settings such as equaliser or bass and treble settings on your head unit to change the sound. you can also use the headphone jack. nothing really wrong with it. the internal amp isnt designed to be used with speakers an line in on equipment which is why there is a line out on many players. give it a try to see if you notice any sound difference. im sure you will hear a little difference. the answer to your question is it really dont matter. its not going to damage your player or your car system.just make sure you turn off all sound enhancements as this will improve SQ. mach3 bass and such seem to distort bass which comes out of speakers. so does the EQ

09-19-2005, 17:22	#4
taz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 683	i personally dont really understand but ah well. i guess it depends what you have the players line out connected to.

09-19-2005, 17:46	#5
niuphan Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 29	There is a difference between the two. The BIGGEST difference I have noticed is the volume level transmitted from the line out vs. the headphone jack. The volume level is at an "unacceptable level" when using the headphone jack. I have to set the volume at almost 40 to get a reasonable amout of "volume" to my stereo using the headphone jack. If you use the line out, the volume is at its peak. Keep in mind you must turn off all of your equalizer settings (BBE, etc) to zero or off. Otherwise the line out will not work any different than the headphone jack. The sub-pack is a MAJOR pain in the ass and very easily separates from the unit (even MORE so if you have a silicon case). This is a terrible design for someone who constantly uses the line out such as myself. There needs to be a line out jack on the unit!!!! C'mon Cowan!!!!

09-19-2005, 18:12	#6
taz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 683	the reason why there is a big difference with the volume is because the headphone jack was only intended for headphones. the line out is just a headphones jack which is already set to volume 40. what ive found is the sound enhancements work with the headphone out but when you use the line out and sound enhancements are on, the sound is not good. maby this is the reason why some people complain of the line out not sounding good. it may be because they leave their sound enhancements on.

09-19-2005, 19:44	#7
Lambart Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 10	Well, what people are saying about line-out being amplified to 40/40 makes no sense--the entire concept of line-out is that it is UNamplified and un(post-)processed, allowing you to use your preferred external amplifier (i.e. home or car stereo). And I can confirm that when I use the line-out on my X5, the audio is much quieter than the headphone jack. UNFORTUNATELY... I am just using line-out for the first time this evening, and it has no output on the right channel! Whether I use my base station or adaptor widget (sub-pack), I only have one channel. Has anyone else had this problem? No, it's not a misadjusted "pan" setting (and once again, logically, that internal amplifier setting should have no effect on line-out). I'm having to use the headphone jack right now for my home stereo, which is absurd (and since I'm using the same cable to the stereo, that eliminates the cable as a possible problem). Does anyone think it might it be a firmware problem (I'm using 2.10b4-e), or am I going to have to return my unit? I can't live without it... I finally got rid of my Rio Karma, which at least worked!

09-20-2005, 10:40	#11
NoComp Banned Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Vienna, Austria Posts: 434	Hy iAUDIO's! My Subpack Line-Out is also definately faulty!!!! (and yes, I know every post on this forum about the Subpack's Line-Out. Only because this is my first post this doesn't mean I'm new to this forum) Only the right channel has a "normal" output-level, the left channel has only about the half of the right level! Why am I so sure that the subpack is the guilty part? Because the Line-out of my Black X5 Cradle is working absolutely fine! Same FULL Output-Level at both Channels!!!! I connected the Line-out's (Cradle & Subpack) to my PC-Audiocard and made some pics of the Level-meters. I used the same song and the same Volume-Level and sent this to COWON-Support! And guess, NO REPLY EVER ON MY REQUESTS FROM COWON!!!! Nor at the Cowon Tech-Support-Forum at their english Homepage!!! One month ago I tried to get a replacement, but after two weeks my German Reseller (mp3-player.de) sent the same subpack back to me - of course with the same faulty Line-Out! Just had a talk with the mp3-player.de-Support and they told me, that they can't get a hold on one single brand new subpack from COWON!!! They can only replace the whole UNIT!!!! (This would cost me about 15 Euros for insured shipping) As it seems COWON won't ever sell subpacks to their European Resellers as it seems!!!! But as we all know these damn subpacks are sold from Cowon-America on ebay.com for 9$ a piece!!! wtf is goin' on COWON?!?!?! The longer I own my X5 30GB the more I love my X5 but the more I hate COWON for its lousy Support-Policy!! Kind of schizophrenic, but nevertheless better than the other way round I guess. But nevertheless, I'm soooo glad that I'm not the only one with this problem!

09-20-2005, 10:54	#12
taz Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 683	therees so many more line out problems for the x5 than there was for the m3. well my m3's cradle and sub pack are both fine. but then again more x5's were probably sold than the m3's. but i dont get it when they should have had the same production techniques and product line creating the subpacks. unless quality control has decreast.

09-20-2005, 11:01	#13
NoComp Banned Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Vienna, Austria Posts: 434	Forgot some interesting detail: As it seems the most Subpacks sold with the first manufactured X5's where original Subpacks designed for the M3!!! Of course I know they also look the same! I once opened my faulty subpacks casing (please read my posting above if you're interested into the Line-Out fault) and found the following tags on the subpacks inner life: M3 V1.1 (in big white letters) I also opened my Black x5-Cradle with the working Line-Out and found following information: Model: M1.3C-A 1.9 M3C_B 1.7 My conclusion: As it seems the subpacks electronic could have been renewed for the X5, so some other people don't recognize any faulty Line-Out anymore! My X5 was one of the first 100 units on the european Market! Maybe thats the point! SO TO EVERYBODY NOT EXPERIENCING ANY SUBPACK LINE-OUT PROBLEMS (the problem with the faulty left Line-Out-Channel): Could you please open your subpacks and check if your subpack-Version is never than M3 V1.1 and post your findings here? By the way its really easy to open (just 2 small screws). All people with this annoying Line-Out fault (including myself) would appreciate any information!! Thanks to everybody for helpin'