X5L vs. NW-HD5 - Page 2

Zeus's Uncle · 08-20-2006, 11:32

Wow dude, you're responding to stuff from a post before your last two replies. As I said, if you want to know everything there is to be said, just check those thread or do some more searches, we've already discussed this and you've said cnet's not a good resource in the same threads in which you offer cnet as a reference. Anyways, whenever you get lany inks from a trusted lab or a link about the non-flat Sony NW-HD5, please post them, obviously many users get better than lab results on all devices, but labs run the exact same tests on all devices in a test. I think you missing a lot of the information already posted in this thread as there are other advantages of NW-HD5 than you list and also other pieces of software already completed and released that can be used to sync with Sony mp3 players. But we're just repeating ourselves now, not only what's already been said here but in the other threads, so unless there is something new to say . . .

afruff23 · 08-20-2006, 14:49

"other advantages"

Care to list?

All currently available software for Sony players are made by Sony. No UMS=BIG disadvantage.

Zeus's Uncle · 08-20-2006, 18:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by afruff23

"other advantages"

Care to list?

All currently available software for Sony players are made by Sony. No UMS=BIG disadvantage.

No, I don't want to list them because I already did list some advantages, as have others, and I don't feel like duplicating what's already been written because either a) you can't be bothered to digest the thread without bias, or b) you are looking to get into yet another bickering match. Let's just end it here. No need for futher repetition, I'm sure we've addressed the concerns of the original poster. Unless you actually do have something new to add, lack of drag & drop in windows explorer (aka UMS as many call it) was already address at the top.

afruff23 · 08-22-2006, 17:21

I'd be wary of Sony DAP build quality(read above post), so the X5 wins IMO in build quality. Bias? Sounds more like you disregarding everybody's battery life reports but cnet...which gave the iPod 5G a higher score than the X5, even though at the X5's "new" period, it was hands-down the best. James Kim just doesn't do his homework.

Zeus's Uncle · 08-22-2006, 17:39

Ok, so nothing new then? Thanks. I'd love to look at the results from the battery tests in other labs when you get a link.

afruff23 · 08-22-2006, 17:59

Labs? You don't seem to trust user reports...

P.S. James Kim is not a lab.

Zeus's Uncle · 08-22-2006, 18:21

Do we really need to go back and forth on this? User reports are not standardized, it is impossible to compare them. User reports will vary even among users of the exact same device, you need only to look at this forum to understand that.

The point of testing in a lab is to see how the devices perform under the same conditions. Even if you and I both ran the same test using the same mp3s it wouldn't be a valid comparison because we would still have other variables to account for, such as temperature or atmospheric pressure or ... These things are standardized in the various labs that test these products (cnet labs, consumer reports, etc.)

So yes, I trust user reports, in that I believe what they are saying; but I can't use them as a comparison tool.

Can this die out now? Why do I bother putting together thoughtful responses to your one or two line posts? Has anyone beside afruff brought up James Kim in this thread?

afruff23 · 08-23-2006, 14:27

You're arguing atmospheric pressure? Wow...it's not as standarized as you think. Again, James Kim is not a lab.

JediKnightPat · 08-24-2006, 20:54

WOW.......

So, I get caught up with work for a few days and everybody descides to argue... I knew that I was opening a can of worms when I posted the question and it needed to be brought up.

Anybody with both a HD5 and a X5L that would care to test in the non-lab setting? Does anybody have a clean room or a hyberberic chamber that they could test devices in?

Any serious buyer should go to several 'labs' or user reports or 'reviews' to get a general allround report on the product in question. This will allow the buyer to get a clear picture of the product in the field, in ideal conditions and when it is being abused.

Jedi

Zeus's Uncle · 08-24-2006, 21:42

Heh, obviously operating temperature has a very significant impact, I just threw pressure down as there was a thread awhile back where someone was climbing to some high altitudes, to the point that the player wouldn't even work. Since the lab doesn't move, that's standardized within it. A user in New Orleans and a user in Denver might be enough of a difference, I dunno, I haven't done the math.

Agreed, on reading multiple lab reports and user reports. User reports are especially good for understanding a device's abilities in specific use cases. Lab tests are good for comparitive numbers like battery life & process performance (such as CPUs doing games or multimedia tasks). That's the way I use those two things.

lostie · 09-13-2006, 13:19

I just wanted to post my few experiences with my brandnew Cowon player

Firstof: The Design
Both players come in a solid metalcase, the X5's is bigger but also stylisher. That is just my opinion. Of course size is a matter of the drive which increases the size of the 60gb X5 compared to the X5 a tiny bit, but not so much that it would be a negative aspect

Usage:
The HD5 is more intuitive to use, but has also nat that bunch of features the X5 has. But once you got into using the iAudio, you find it as easy to use as the HD5.

Functions:
For the HD5 stand a fairly good but not all complete (compared to iPod 5G interface) ID3 Library, a feature that is missing on the Cowon.
But for the iAudio are fm-tuner; the USB-OnTheGo function; video (ok, the HD5 has no colour-screen) and recording possibilites.

Batterylife:
The X5 keeps a good battery, lasting bewteen 13 and 15 hours for me, but doubled by the HD5's that lasts about 30 to 35 hours for me.

Sound:
Well, easy to say: the X5 is definitvely the number one in this section of the test. Just clear sound and no distorsions like the Sony has. And it delivers more output power on the headphone jack.

Getting music on the device:
iAudio: Just drag and drop your files oder use some kind of backup-software
Sony: You HAVE to use Sony's proprietary SonicStage software or the MP3filemanager (originally not designed for this device) as Sony puts Copyprotection on the files.

Fazit: I'm super-happy with my new X5 and hope to spend a couple of nice years with it

test equipment for sound: shure e2c; Harmann Kardon Citation (preamp+amp+nubert speaker set)

afruff23 · 09-13-2006, 21:19

Would you agree that the NW-HD5 EQ's sound by default?(even if it is set to 0).

lostie · 09-14-2006, 07:42

thats hard to tell but i would say no.
but the HD5-EQ can only be completely used (as 6-band EQ) when playing atrac-files. for mp3 there ist just the possibility to modify the lower 3 bands and the upper 3 bands at one time.
but back to your question: i would not say that even if tourned off, the eq works.

afruff23 · 09-14-2006, 15:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by lostie

thats hard to tell but i would say no.
but the HD5-EQ can only be completely used (as 6-band EQ) when playing atrac-files. for mp3 there ist just the possibility to modify the lower 3 bands and the upper 3 bands at one time.
but back to your question: i would not say that even if tourned off, the eq works.

So which is it?

lostie · 09-19-2006, 14:37

uhm sorry. got myself confused there.
the eq does not work if turned off.

08-20-2006, 11:32	#16
Zeus's Uncle multimedia aficionado Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,157	Wow dude, you're responding to stuff from a post before your last two replies. As I said, if you want to know everything there is to be said, just check those thread or do some more searches, we've already discussed this and you've said cnet's not a good resource in the same threads in which you offer cnet as a reference. Anyways, whenever you get lany inks from a trusted lab or a link about the non-flat Sony NW-HD5, please post them, obviously many users get better than lab results on all devices, but labs run the exact same tests on all devices in a test. I think you missing a lot of the information already posted in this thread as there are other advantages of NW-HD5 than you list and also other pieces of software already completed and released that can be used to sync with Sony mp3 players. But we're just repeating ourselves now, not only what's already been said here but in the other threads, so unless there is something new to say . . . __________________ Ray, when someone asks if you're a god, you say "Yes!" Should afruff decide to contradict or address me, and you would like a response, please let me know; he is on my ignore list. Quality AND Quantity.

08-22-2006, 17:21	#19
afruff23 Hater of Epithets Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,062	I'd be wary of Sony DAP build quality(read above post), so the X5 wins IMO in build quality. Bias? Sounds more like you disregarding everybody's battery life reports but cnet...which gave the iPod 5G a higher score than the X5, even though at the X5's "new" period, it was hands-down the best. James Kim just doesn't do his homework. Last edited by afruff23; 08-22-2006 at 17:25..

08-22-2006, 17:39	#20
Zeus's Uncle multimedia aficionado Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,157	Ok, so nothing new then? Thanks. I'd love to look at the results from the battery tests in other labs when you get a link. __________________ Ray, when someone asks if you're a god, you say "Yes!" Should afruff decide to contradict or address me, and you would like a response, please let me know; he is on my ignore list. Quality AND Quantity.

08-22-2006, 18:21	#22
Zeus's Uncle multimedia aficionado Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,157	Do we really need to go back and forth on this? User reports are not standardized, it is impossible to compare them. User reports will vary even among users of the exact same device, you need only to look at this forum to understand that. The point of testing in a lab is to see how the devices perform under the same conditions. Even if you and I both ran the same test using the same mp3s it wouldn't be a valid comparison because we would still have other variables to account for, such as temperature or atmospheric pressure or ... These things are standardized in the various labs that test these products (cnet labs, consumer reports, etc.) So yes, I trust user reports, in that I believe what they are saying; but I can't use them as a comparison tool. Can this die out now? Why do I bother putting together thoughtful responses to your one or two line posts? Has anyone beside afruff brought up James Kim in this thread? __________________ Ray, when someone asks if you're a god, you say "Yes!" Should afruff decide to contradict or address me, and you would like a response, please let me know; he is on my ignore list. Quality AND Quantity. Last edited by Zeus's Uncle; 08-23-2006 at 17:14..

08-24-2006, 21:42	#25
Zeus's Uncle multimedia aficionado Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,157	Heh, obviously operating temperature has a very significant impact, I just threw pressure down as there was a thread awhile back where someone was climbing to some high altitudes, to the point that the player wouldn't even work. Since the lab doesn't move, that's standardized within it. A user in New Orleans and a user in Denver might be enough of a difference, I dunno, I haven't done the math. Agreed, on reading multiple lab reports and user reports. User reports are especially good for understanding a device's abilities in specific use cases. Lab tests are good for comparitive numbers like battery life & process performance (such as CPUs doing games or multimedia tasks). That's the way I use those two things. __________________ Ray, when someone asks if you're a god, you say "Yes!" Should afruff decide to contradict or address me, and you would like a response, please let me know; he is on my ignore list. Quality AND Quantity. Last edited by Zeus's Uncle; 08-24-2006 at 23:17..

08-20-2006, 14:49	#17
afruff23 Hater of Epithets Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,062	"other advantages" Care to list? All currently available software for Sony players are made by Sony. No UMS=BIG disadvantage.

08-22-2006, 17:59	#21
afruff23 Hater of Epithets Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,062	Labs? You don't seem to trust user reports... P.S. James Kim is not a lab.

08-23-2006, 14:27	#23
afruff23 Hater of Epithets Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,062	You're arguing atmospheric pressure? Wow...it's not as standarized as you think. Again, James Kim is not a lab.

08-24-2006, 20:54	#24
JediKnightPat Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 11	WOW....... So, I get caught up with work for a few days and everybody descides to argue... I knew that I was opening a can of worms when I posted the question and it needed to be brought up. Anybody with both a HD5 and a X5L that would care to test in the non-lab setting? Does anybody have a clean room or a hyberberic chamber that they could test devices in? Any serious buyer should go to several 'labs' or user reports or 'reviews' to get a general allround report on the product in question. This will allow the buyer to get a clear picture of the product in the field, in ideal conditions and when it is being abused. Jedi

09-13-2006, 13:19	#26
lostie Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 27	Comparison Cowon iAudio X5 (60gb) - Sony NW-HD5 (20gb) I just wanted to post my few experiences with my brandnew Cowon player Firstof: The Design Both players come in a solid metalcase, the X5's is bigger but also stylisher. That is just my opinion. Of course size is a matter of the drive which increases the size of the 60gb X5 compared to the X5 a tiny bit, but not so much that it would be a negative aspect Usage: The HD5 is more intuitive to use, but has also nat that bunch of features the X5 has. But once you got into using the iAudio, you find it as easy to use as the HD5. Functions: For the HD5 stand a fairly good but not all complete (compared to iPod 5G interface) ID3 Library, a feature that is missing on the Cowon. But for the iAudio are fm-tuner; the USB-OnTheGo function; video (ok, the HD5 has no colour-screen) and recording possibilites. Batterylife: The X5 keeps a good battery, lasting bewteen 13 and 15 hours for me, but doubled by the HD5's that lasts about 30 to 35 hours for me. Sound: Well, easy to say: the X5 is definitvely the number one in this section of the test. Just clear sound and no distorsions like the Sony has. And it delivers more output power on the headphone jack. Getting music on the device: iAudio: Just drag and drop your files oder use some kind of backup-software Sony: You HAVE to use Sony's proprietary SonicStage software or the MP3filemanager (originally not designed for this device) as Sony puts Copyprotection on the files. Fazit: I'm super-happy with my new X5 and hope to spend a couple of nice years with it test equipment for sound: shure e2c; Harmann Kardon Citation (preamp+amp+nubert speaker set) Last edited by lostie; 09-13-2006 at 13:25..

09-13-2006, 21:19	#27
afruff23 Hater of Epithets Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,062	Would you agree that the NW-HD5 EQ's sound by default?(even if it is set to 0).

09-14-2006, 07:42	#28
lostie Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 27	thats hard to tell but i would say no. but the HD5-EQ can only be completely used (as 6-band EQ) when playing atrac-files. for mp3 there ist just the possibility to modify the lower 3 bands and the upper 3 bands at one time. but back to your question: i would not say that even if tourned off, the eq works.

09-19-2006, 14:37	#30
lostie Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 27	uhm sorry. got myself confused there. the eq does not work if turned off.

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